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The war takes a toll on printing costs

5/9/2007 6:12:21 PM

BillZebub

219 posts

The war takes a toll on printing costs
Modified By BillZebub on 5/9/2007 5:15:22 PM)

According to the latest price quotes for printing all-glossy, the war has driven prices for aluminum higher and higher. I have to call more printers to confirm this statement. Hopefully it's not a scam (a lie to get more money from publishers). If the statement is true, then that will be one more reason for dividing the Grimoire into MANY forms of media.

I've been thinking of making a newspaper version of the Grimoire that would be available for free at metal shows, shops, bars, and other such places, and to make a super high quality full color PDF version for on-line distribution (which people all over the world can download and print on their photo printers so they can enjoy the exclusive photographs and artwork), and of course to archive all interviews and reviews on this site for convenience to all others.

You see, after Tower Records went bankrupt, the last big chain that tolerated my unusual content died too. For me to continue benefitting from mainstream distribution I can no longer include certain types of pictures, art, or even certain types of written content. I can get away with some of the written stuff because the decision-makers/buyers don't really read magazines (they just look at them), but all it would take is one big-mouth to complain to corporate headquarters and then my stuff goes bye-bye (that happened at Newbury Comics with "Jesus Christ: Serial Rapist).

I think that if I were to drastically change style and become more "tame" then I have no right to continue printing under the same name. That name means something to many people. Plus, I have never changed anything for such stupid reasons. Why would I do that now? In an era when other death metal magazines were starting to cover gay music like hardcore, and even emo, I refused - I would not even let those people buy advertisement space. Other mags "branched out" because they were seduced by the extra money coming from non-metal labels, and sales of mags increased because harcore and emo fags far outnumber extreme metal fans. I proved to them all that I can restrict the coverage to 99% underground metal and to still thrive - I got the mag to almost full color, all glossy, and on mainstream newsstands! Why would I spit on my own legacy and become the fag that others have become? No thank you. The Grimoire shall forever remain the bastion of brutal sarcasm, superb metal, offbeat comedy, and will stand strong as the enemy of the "majority-rules" mentality.

5/9/2007 9:56:24 PM

Jewsef Mengele

105 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I'm glad you're not thinking of pussifying The Grimoire. You could raise the price of the mag. I mean people spend $8-$10 on Fangoria and your mag is much thicker and glossier. Your magazine is also far more original than any other music mag on the market. If someone reads a band interview it will be the exact same in every other mag (Metal Maniacs, SOD, Unrestrained (unrestrained my ass) and Brave Words.) All these mags are interchangable with one another and that isn't lost on the buying public. Your target is mature readers anyway, so whats preventing you from putting the mag on any newstand shelf right next to Hustler and Playboy? Won't the average Hustler reader see the mag and get off on the humor AND the girls? Christ, ever hear of Heavy Metal: Mens Fantasy comic magazine? Now THAT'S a fucking niche mag and they're selling plenty. They're right on the shelf next to the porn, and geeks don't seem to have any problem finding it. The PDFs are nice, but I like to have something I can take in the shitter with me.

5/9/2007 10:57:09 PM

DeadAlive

134 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I'm going to be honest- I'm not a fan of the all glossy mags. I mean, they'll do as long as the content remains the same, but I MUCH prefer the newsprint format. There's something magical about the newsprint format. All the issues seem very retro, and the magazine is more comfortable to read. Newsprint is easier to grip, and is more flexible than the glossy stuff. Also the newsprint issues were the perfect size, while I think the all glossy stuff is a tad large. Whatever- as long as what's inside the magazine stays the same, I'll keep reading, but I thought I might just throw in the advantages of newsprint from my point of view.

Oh, and Jewsef brings an excellent point. There's this magazine I enjoy reading called SWANK. It is the most hardcore porno mag I have eer seen. I get it from my local convienient store, and I shell out about 12 bucks an issue. It comes with a DVD, but the DVDs suck and don't show anything good, so I skip em. You could easily charge more for the Grimoire. 5 dollars is extremely cheap for a mag nowadays, a few more bucks won't hurt.

5/10/2007 12:33:38 AM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

Thanks for the input.

I personally like the all-glossy format, but if I stay that way, I won't charge more. That's the easy answer. Easy answers don't lead to creativity.

Jewsef suggested something ironic - to keep the format but to sell the mag among porn mags. Some Tower Record shops (and others) in the bible-belt acually put my mag in the porn section. To me, that doesn't mix. Porn people don't look for metal, and metal people don't look for metal mags in the porn section. So sales from both groups suffer. But if that is the only way to go, word-pf-mouth can spread and let the wise metal readers know that they have to find the mag in the boob section and my name will be Bill ZeBoob.

As a free mag, newsprint is the best option. It's relatively cheap for huge quantities.

5/10/2007 5:03:05 AM

Stormcloud

22 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I would really like to see the Grimoire as a newspaper, especially if you fuck with the pictures. I can just imagine someone picking up a copy expecting to read something about metal and then all of a sudden seeing a picture of a band with all coneheads or something like that.

5/10/2007 4:38:02 PM

Jewsef Mengele

105 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I realise you would know more about the magazine business than me, but just for the sake of argument. Its not just porn they put on the top shelf but also special interest magazines. Tattoos, weed, wrestling... All these are niche mags and the fans that read these are probably more open minded to new stuff than the average Metal Maniacs faggot. Also, metal fan or not, ALL guys check out the porn section and your mags geared toward men right? If all guys scope the porn and special interest section then all METALHEADS check em out as well. I would think putting your magazine in the porn section would be elating, because it would free you to take the content to the limit. (No more "censored" boxes over the ladies boxes!) By the way, how many people here actually bought The Grimoire anywhere but a metal show or the net? I bet NOBODY here went to Mr Paperback to get a faggy mainstream metal mag and happened to notice the witty and brutal humor of The Grimoire and bought that instead. In fact, isn't the average Metal Maniacs reader goin to cry and protest the sale of the mag? If your magazine isn't for a mainstream audience, why put it with the mainstream mags? I absolutey think that word of mouth would make The Grimoire stick apart from the awful skin mags (that no metal head reads. HA!)

5/10/2007 10:23:58 PM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

Your points are all valid. I'm actually thinking of increasing the amount of color pages in the all-glossy format and add more pics of girls - that is, if I go the "adult section" route.

Even when the mag was newsprint and free-where-available, i was very surpirsed by how many non-metal readers I had. After all, you don't need to know about the band to find the insults funny.

I've also noticed that when I go to horror conventions, most people who buy the mag at my vendor booth don't look like they listen to metal, expecialy the people who look like lawyers, lol.

The healthiest metal-market I have ever personally experienced was at the Maryland Deathfest. People came to my table like pirranhas (spelling?). People were totally happy to take chances on things.

Well, I got the names of some places that specialize in newsprint and I'll check on their prices. I still don't believe the story about aluminum prices going up. I had always considered that to be a super-cheap metal, lol.

5/11/2007 4:40:18 PM

Booger

15 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

What happens when you find out you were being lied to about the aluminum?

5/17/2007 1:36:47 AM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

Well, I just got a very nice price quote and it looks like the first tabloid issue of the Grimoire is going to be out in August. It's going to get thicker as I get more advertisers.

The tabloid version will be free where available, mostly in NY and NJ at record stores, tattoo shops, bars, clubs, various concerts, and some college campuses.

5/17/2007 8:46:27 PM

DeadAlive

134 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

Any way if we sent postage costs, we can get a copy mailed to us to guarantee the reading pleasure?

5/21/2007 6:06:53 AM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I think that the tabloid version will go a similar route to the old days when the Grimoire was newsprint - free where available, and through the mail for $3. I'm still sorting out all of the details. Coincidentally, I've been running into a lot of people who remembered seeing the newsprint version and had assumed that the mag folded (obviously they were spoiled and never bothered checking the web or looking for it in shops). In any case, they were very excited about the mag becomng available again as a free periodical. The distinction this time is not only the tabloid format, but the calssification of a "regional" mag (about 80% of the circulation will be NJ, 10% NY, and the other 10% dispersed via the horror convention route).

8/2/2007 1:37:52 AM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

The fuckhead at the new printing place shot me a cowardly Email today to let me know that he's too pussy to print the mag. I have to look into the legal rammifications of this. Printers should not be allowed to impose their own tastes onto other people. This is something that I really want to pursue, legally. I never had a problem with a printer being a censorship-fascist before, but I would like to set some sort of legal precedent to forbid this kind of policy. Setting a legal precedent will make sure that stuff like this doesn't happen in the future. And I am not looking out just for myself. The printer is a foreigner, so he needs to know that he is in a free country. Censorship isn't taken very lightly here.

8/2/2007 10:20:52 PM

Jewsef Mengele

105 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I just assumed all printers had their own rules when it came to printing. That's why one of the first questions I asked when I was calling places for a price quote on my gay little mag was "do you have a problem with printing offensive material?" Ha!The people I went with claimed they didn't but they changed their mind and now they want me to bring in a sample. Changing your mind is gay, but refusing to print outright is something I thought was quite common. Don't bands always complain about printing plants refusing service because of an offensive album cover?

8/2/2007 10:31:12 PM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I've been printing since 1996 and I never came across this problem. Today I contacted some places, and when I got to the stage right before getting a quote, I asked, "Do you practice censorship or otherwise refuse to print certain material?" and each time I got a laugh. There was one guy in particular who said, "Did you ever hear fo such a thing as freedom of the press?" So it just shows that I had found an outlier. If I were in mormon country I would expect this. But this is why I want to sue the faggot printer for forcing his agenda.

8/3/2007 1:49:06 AM

DeadAlive

134 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I don't get that if you're a printer, why it would matter what the material you are printing is. The printer's name doesn't have to be attached to it. I hate to sound like a Jew, but why would you turn down a willing customer?

8/3/2007 3:22:24 AM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

Apparently they are afraid of their workers getting offended. It's silly because this particular issue doesn't have anything visually shocking. You would actually have to read the Malevolent Creation interview (and not have a sense of humor), but workers have no business reading the tabloid. They are there just to run the job.

Like I posted before, other printers are shaking their heads about this, and they are more than happy to bid on the job, especially if this tabloid becomes a quarterly that prints 40,000 each run.

Workers in print shops should sign a waiver (preventing them from suing their employer for being subjectd to various material). It's not like a work environment like telemarketing, or a help desk. Maybe this is news to you, but in most corporate environments, uptight twats have sued because a co-worker had a calander that had girls in bikinis, or a screen saver of a girl in a mini skirt. These worthless cunts have no care what their greed has done - it has stripped away freedom, and reality. We, as a society, really shouldn't reward people for having weak stomachs, weak minds, and who act like babies when they see or hear somethign they don't like.

There was a post on here that was deleted, but the essence of it was that someone complained about certain outsiders coming to metal shows. That's just reality. You might not remember the days when skinheads infiltrated a show just to be assholes. I don't think anyone was a baby about it and went crying to the club owner to throw them out. You could stew in anger and not have any fun, or you can ignore what you don't like. There have been numerous jobs I had in which I suffered miserably because I had to listen to adult contempory music or other garbage. Even if I wanted to be a bitch about it, something like that isn't considered a hostile work environment even though it's like kryptonite to me. Knowing that it was beyond my control made it easy to tune out. I don't know why it's so hard for people to just tune out what they don't like. But then, i know that in some cases people can get money. I actually laughed a few years ago when I started a job in a corporate environment - there were three girls who were absent. Why? They were not required to go to work until after their harrassment suits were resolved (and they were paid for the time off). I befriended one of them when she finally showed up for work, and she confessed that she filed because she saw the perks of the other two who filed.

It's just nuts that this is the only printer ever to pull a stunt like this. I know one of their accounts, and I am very tempted to use all of my persuasion to get the big account (a weekly newspaper) to stop using that particular printer. I am on the verge of doing that. When I decide on which printer to use, I will do my best to get people to leave the printer of pussiness.

8/3/2007 12:30:11 PM

satansacolyte

2 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs

I'm assuming that it was my post that was deleted. It was meant half in jest given that this is a comedic site. I have never once complained to a club owner, I do not "stew in anger" and I enjoy myself just fine. Furthermore, I do not need the psychoanalysis concerning how I deal with reality. I'm quite adept at tuning out the undesirable which I will proceed to do forthwith.

8/3/2007 1:38:03 PM

BillZebub

219 posts

Re: The war takes a toll on printing costs
Modified By BillZebub on 8/3/2007 12:40:38 PM)

No offense, but your jokes don't have a joke quality. Jewsef (one of the guys who posts stuff) is pretty good at making the "vibe" of his post pretty clear.

When I make a racial joke, all other things aside, I say it under my name, a name that is recognized, and I am a person who is out in public and who people can confront. When you post, people don't know who you are. You never have to face the music. I don't let people have Internet balls on my site (well, in some cases I do - there were some Internet balls between some people in arguments about Grom on the black metal thread - that was funny stuff).

I'm not saying that you are an asshole. I'm just asking that you to post your special kind of "venting" on other sites. It's coming across bad -that's all. Don't take the deleted threads personally.

Some time ago Rocco (an actor) wanted to review albums for me, so I gave him a test batch. I told him NOT to write the reviews for a general audience. He should write the reviews for himself, as if he were writing the review for the "him" of yestersay. I also warned him not to try to be funny, and I told him that I wasn't looking for another Metal Monster. He wrote the most stupid and gay reviews I have ever read. He tried to be Metal Monster. His reviews seriously sounded like some fag having a hissy fit. It was the "metal" equivalent of a moody faggot fashion designer making remarks about a woman's wardrobe. The way he tried to imitate Metal Monster also showed that certain kinds of humor may seem simple and easy to pull off, but the truth is that not everyone is cut out to make those kinds of jokes. Rocco also used terms like "turd burglar." Funny thing is that only fags use that word. Fags also use words like "tool." So he was a poor choice for a reviewer even if he followed the basic rules I set forth - he uses preppie, minority, and gay slang.

The parallel is that, in real life I hung out with him, but I would never let him write a review.

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